Grant Williams: What NBA Players Know That Collectors Don’t

I never pulled my own auto rookie because I don't have one. What's that like? Box of Panini one-on-one and I hadn't ripped that product ever. Sure, it's my rookie year. I've never done this before and I opened it and it's a Celtics box and pulled over the length for it. I was like, cool. I looked down and it's me. Staring back at you. What are the odds that the one box you've had in your closet for the past four years hoping that Zion was going to be amazing had me in it? Welcome to the Collector Nation podcast here on the Collector Nation Network. Whether you're chasing grails or calling bluffs, we take you inside the hobby. Here's your host, Ryan Alford. What's up, guys? I had a great conversation today with Grant Williams. Yeah, that Grant Williams. He's the forward of the Charlotte Hornets, which are right up the road from us here in South Carolina. Grant was awesome. We talked all about his venture into collecting. He's still just a collector. It's not a business. It's collecting for him. Talked about what it's like being a player, collecting other players, and how many other NBA stars are collecting cards. Lots of fun talking about rips, talking about the boys and how we got into the industry. Really fun conversation. Grant is a lovable, likable guy. I was a fan. I'm even bigger. You will be bigger after you listen to this. And let me tell you, and a little insight about what happens when those signature cards end up on the Superstars coffee table. That and more right now. What's up, guys? We are here. And you know, we're going deep. We're going long. We're going right up the road to Charlotte from where we are. We got the forward from the Charlotte Hornets, Grant Williams. What's up, Grant? How's it going, Ryan? How's it going, Ryan? Dude, I am pumped. I get to talk a little basketball. I get to talk a little cards. I get to talk Charlotte Hornets. I grew up, you know, right down the road. The Hornets were a, what is it, an expansion team or whatever you call it back in the day. I'm aging myself. That's how long it's been. They've had names, two different names now, Grant. You were alive since the 88, 88 expansion? Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, dude. I was 11 years old. You got the best of years and then you got the low of years. Now you're back to the best of years. I know. Exactly. You guys are exciting, man. I mean, congrats on the season. I mean, I was rooting for you. You guys look good. I mean, it's been a long time coming. I mean, just just being real about it. But now it looks like they got a lot of a lot of good shit happening. Absolutely. I grew up here in Charlotte. I feel the same way. You know, I was here during the Bobcat years. I didn't get your I didn't get the other the other Hornets where you had the Del Curry's and the Red Shepard's. I was dealing with D.J. Augustine, the Mecca Okafor's, you know, Gerald Wallace's. You know, I had I had that group. So, like you said, I've seen two teams. I've seen the Bobcats and now the Hornets. I'm going to bring back the buzz campaign and. Yeah, it feels good to be a part of the group that hopefully I can turn it around and make something special here. You know, it's super exciting and fun to watch for the generation after me. Yeah, man. How is it going? Like, it looks like if it's the first time I was watching the playoff game and, you know, I know it didn't end exactly like you wanted. But at the same time, I was just like, this is the first time it's felt like this team's together. I don't know. Something felt a little different. Yeah, there's a level of camaraderie with this group. The group is very connected, but also I think we're establishing a foundation, a great culture with a bunch of guys who now are focused on the right things and winning, but also preparing, having work, making sure that we're... Elevating one another every single day, not just on the floor, but off as well. So outside of just what the organization is building with the from the top to bottom front office to the coaches to have all the way down to the players. You also have the group of individuals who. No, I'm focused on just the day to day. You know, I feel like we don't look ahead to 20, 30 games away or we don't look at the future of playoffs. We kind of focus in on just making sure we can be the best us we can possibly be and how we show up is is critical. I love it, bro. I'm rooting for you. I think y'all got something brewing and. How long, how many years are you in the league, bro? This is now my, going into my eighth year of the NBA. Yeah, I'm kind of getting a little dated myself a little bit. Dude, eight years. That's great, though. I mean, you've beaten average by like, what, seven years? Yeah, I would say average, I think, is normally around three. So, yeah, like I said, it's been five extra years, and then hopefully, you know, go from here, try and play as long as I possibly can. But honestly, it's a great place to be. Charlotte has been, you know, phenomenal in terms of, you know, starting football. like the organizational foundation. Started in Boston my first four years. We accomplished some great things. You know, I went to finals, you know, went to a couple of conference finals. It was just a great experience. And I was able to go now to Dallas and now see the development of this Hornets team. It's kind of, you see every part of the league. You saw the best of teams. You saw the middle of T, like the mid kind of like middle side. And then you've seen the worst now back up to the middle side's big best again. Yeah. I, uh, my son trains, he's 10 with Bryce McGowan's, uh, father. Bobby. And so he's training. So we root for Bryce, who's with the Pelicans. And he's got a brother that's pretty good, too. Yeah, his brother's good. I played with Bryce when he was first on the Hornets. I got traded here, and Bryce was still on the team before. And that following summer, I believe, that's when he left the Summer League and when it got signed to the Blazers. Yeah, man. He's got, I think he's got another gear to unlock. He needed to put on a little weight. He did. He looked good this year. I mean, he played a lot, so I'm rooting for him. But I figured you might know that name. His dad's awesome. I mean, like, just salt of the earth guy and worked with my wife and love that family. Good people. Dude, when do we get into collecting? Yeah, collecting started, honestly, what was it, when I was younger? Like I started at a very young age. I was playing Yu-Gi-Oh, I was playing Pokemon. It was more TCG than it was sports collecting. Like I had some cards due to my family who played. Like I had Sling Stoudemire cards or signed jerseys and things of that nature, like memorabilia. But it wasn't really started to card journey until probably 2020 was when I got back into the hobby. And it started with going to, The National. I did a deal with eBay, came to the National, talked about how I collected in the past, and they were like, hey, have you ever gotten into it recently? I said, no. So went out to the show. saw the environment and ripped a box of shadowless Pokemon, which is what I was into back when I was doing TCG. And I had a shadowless Mewtwo. Still have the card upstairs and my PC to this day. And I was like, you know what? Like, I'm getting back into this and then kind of just went in from there. From 2020 to 2022, 2023, I was all TCG. And then Fanatics Fest happened and I ripped sports for the first time with Bricks with Jess, Jess Maneo and She was walking me around the show. I was like, hey, have you ever ripped sports? I said, no, I have no idea what the sports market's like. Don't know anything about why do you collect certain players versus others, why the hobby is the way it is. I was just ripping. I ended up ripping the 2018-19 National Treasures Luca Auto RPA out of 10, true RPA. When I sold that for the auction, I was like, looks like I'm into sports now, too. When that went on, I went sports and TCG, so I have a little bit of everything now. That that economic chart goes up a little in sports, both the both the upfront cost and the upside. Right. I don't know. Pokemon to Pokemon now is vintage, at least is ridiculous. Five thousand five thousand dollar packs. You know, back then we're paying six hundred dollars or a thousand here and there. Even that was expensive to me. So, yes, sports now is insane as well. You depend on certain products. You look at top scrum, hobby, top scrum, football, either in basketball. You look at. anything sports related. Baseball is kind of the one low kind of entry point, but even then it's still not considered low. It's still expensive, like $700 box. I know it's become, uh, I don't know. It's, it's a whole nother gear right now. I, I, I own a shop. I'm sure I shoot this show right out of our shop. We're going to have to get you down here, man. Uh, Oh, yeah. Some. And it's a cool store, man. It's I. It's the flagship store, South Carolina. I'm I'm going to go ahead and put it out there and not knocking any other store. I'm saying we got three thousand square feet studio built in. It feels like a sports bar. We got a pack bar. So it's legit. What to get you down here. The that'd be sick. The but the dude. Yeah. And my boys and I got into it. That's what we did. We were ripping. I got four boys. They're age 10 to 16 now. When we got into it, it was like, you know, 8 to 14. So it was a couple years ago. And I collected growing up. But, dude, when you got 5D rolling every time you open packs, that shit gets expensive. That adds up quick. I'm like, man, I'm like, we ripped through like a hundred grand in like six months. I don't even, I don't even know what, I was like, we were into it, man. But it was fun, man. It was like, you know, doing it with your kids, you know? What's been your favorite pull experience with, with them? Like, has there ever been a card or even just a experience where it's like, maybe it's not a card, but just a rip where you're like, wow, this is like something that I'll always remember. Yeah, man. It was like, well, here's, there's so many now because we got into it and we're football family. Right. I went to Clemson and Clemson's football territory. This is Clemson, you know, Clemson territory where we live. So college football and then pro football, just pro football, college football, all footballs, you know, in the South. Right. And so, and I played basketball growing up. So we do love basketball. So it was easy. We were either open football, maybe basketball or football. Yeah. And so we were literally, it was beginning right when the 24th season with all the hot rookie quarterbacks. Yep. And we opened, I don't know how many, I mean, we knew every variation there was of every parallel of Caleb, of JJ, of Jaden Daniels and Bo Nix. And so we have a lot and we would film it like of us getting like autographs or like out of tens, you know, like low numbered stuff, but of like Caleb and boat, like one moment that recall a general, we were about to go to bed. We always do it at night. Like it was like late night, about to go to bed and it was one of those all one more box things, you know? Right. And this one laugh, you know, and my one son who's always using into kind of what, and then he decided to, you know, he'd get one pack in. And he ripped, like, the most ridiculous Bo Nix, like, out of 10 auto. I mean, it was at the time probably, like, five grand, like, maybe not five, three grand made card. And it was, like, literally the last pack. So that's why it made it mineral. It was like he didn't, he was going to just bail it, let someone, we were going to get it either. Somebody was going to open it either way. Right. But it was sort of all that. And then, I mean, we have it on video. Yeah, dude. Yeah. Like when I was ripping the best story, like best story I said, I'm gonna need my partner, my fiance Kiki to start ripping more because like that's how it happened. When every time I were with her, her friend, we ripped something crazy. When I was with her friend, Treasury, she ripped the Victor Women Yama auto, like numbered to seven, like to 99. And I was like, those true rookie, I was like, wow, this is insane. And then Tops Mercury, she ripped it out of 10 patch auto. I was like, wow. And then my fiance, we're just sitting on the couch Same year, it's about 2024, Tops Chrome. But this time it was Sapphire. So we're just sitting there ripping and ripping boxes. And we had one case, like found it, like had a relationship to get a case, ripped it. And I'm not hitting anything. I think the best card I hit was like, I think the best card I had a non-auto Drake May 225, which I was super excited about. So of course, I thought that was the best card I was getting out of the box. And then all of a sudden she's just ripping, ripping, ripping. She pulls his card aside. She's like, I got this redemption. It's called Caleb Williams. It says Papa, Papa, Papa, Papa something. And I said, I said, Papa Redaska. And she's like, yeah, it says Caleb Williams, top scroll and popular. I said, you know, that's a one of one Caleb Williams. All right. She said, no. And like, you know, she had no idea. Yeah. In her hand was one of the cars that, you know, I ended up moving it. You know, I think I moved it for close to 70 or something like that. But. It made it worthwhile. It made it worthwhile. Like I screamed. I was excited. Like I had the video on my, we were recording. So fortunately we're recording. We're just laying on the couch and she, she ripped it and had no reaction. And that's why I said like, she needs to start ripping more, uh, with me. Cause she has the hot hands whenever she, cause she doesn't know the product. So she was like, yeah, this is, yeah, is this good? And it was like, well, yeah, man. Yeah. Yeah. So, all right, I brought up another one. So my oldest son, Clayton, is probably the least into cards. He's into cards, but it's just the three of them are like off the chain, you know, into it. And he's kind of the least into it. He liked to do it, but he kind of take it or leave it. This was early. It was like the first. We finally got him into it. We were watching the Super Bowl. Not this year's Super Bowl, the year before. Right. We're ripping through absolute. And he doesn't know the cards either. Right. And so we're watching the game. We're all ripping, kind of watching the game out. And he's going through them. And he's calling them out. He's calling out the names because he knows most of the players but doesn't know the card if there's inserts and all that. He's going through it. Okay. Name, name, name. Kaboom. Name. Wait, wait, wait. It was a good 15, 20 seconds. I stopped because I knew I thought I'd heard a trigger word. Yeah. You thought you heard it. You're like, kaboom. It's not really a normal word that you say anymore. The old school cartoon name. I said, And he'd already, like, gone through the whole pack and set it down. And he had no idea. Right. And I said, did you say kaboom? And he goes, yeah. I had one that said kaboom. Look, a pretty cool card. And the other three boys start chiming in. And we go, what? And we go through it. And literally, he had a kaboom in the pack. And it was literally Kansas City Chiefs were playing. And it was worthy. Yeah. for Kansas City. So he was wearing the kaboom? Yeah, kaboom. Wow. And he was on the screen, like, when we grabbed the card. Like, it was that. Like, what? And he's probably sitting there thinking nothing of it. Like, oh, yeah, it's just kaboom. No, he had no idea. He had no idea if it was just a regular. Because, you know, they have a lot of inserts that are pretty cool. And if any, now that we know, yeah, actually, I'm holding a Julius Herving kaboom right here. There we go. It's one you can't forget. You just, you're mentally tying that to a high value card. But there's so many, there's a lot of those inserts that look like they could be a case hit, but aren't. Oh yeah. All the time when you're ripping, you're like, when I first opened a product and I don't, I never look at a checklist. So like anytime I rip for the first time, any video I post, it's me ripping without knowledge of what's in the box. Yeah. So like, I'll be like, is this good? Like, is this a Bowman, Bowman Sterling? And then I'll like go back and look at like, okay, it's not enough. But then like. There was one time I was ripping and I'm like this insert. And I was like, yeah, it says Aura. But like, is that like, I don't know if Aura is a case hit or anything like that. So I put it to the side. And then you go look up the checklist and you're like, Aura is a case hit or SSP. And it's like, oh, you got to go now search through 100 cards just to be able to find that one card you put to the side thinking it was nothing. Yeah, because there's some that are sort of obvious and there's some that aren't like like there's the obvious ones are like the, you know, the ones where you're like, oh, slammy. And this dude has a huge head head like something. Gotta be. Gotta be huge versus like other ones. You're like, I've seen like two of those. You know, they might both be SSPs, but I have no idea. I mean, I'll say this. Here's what I've never done that you have. And that's back in January. I never pulled my own auto rookie out of a box. Right. Because I don't have one. What's that like? Oh, sheesh. When I was in, um, that's a funny time. The best experience that I've had is when I was sitting with Jess, actually. She had a box of Panini one-on-one and I hadn't ripped that product ever. Like I was this one card, like what makes me like, how is this a super exciting product? She's like, well, if you hit like a crazy auto. You know, you're going to be happy, whether Zion, John. I was like, yeah. I was like, what if you hit like, I don't know, like I don't know about sports. So then I started thinking about it and she's like, I'll buy it off you. Sure. It's my year, my rookie year. I've never done this before. She has me the box. I pay her for it. And I open it. And it's a Celtics box. I'm like, okay. So Roman Langford's on the top. And pull Roman Langford out. I was like, cool. I look down. It's me. It's like. Staring back at you. Staring back at me. I'm like, what are the odds that the one box you've had in your closet for the past four years that you, only box that you bought of this product that you were holding for the longest, hoping that Zion was going to be amazing, had me in it. And we just met two weeks ago. Crazy. And next thing you know, I look at it, it's patch out of a five, and I was like, what, how does this happen? And also, I remember sitting at the Panini when I first got drafted, when I was sitting there signing all these cards, I remember signing this card. So it's like, it's really funny. That's crazy. It's cool when you hit yourself, but then you have to remember like, do I even remember signing this? Like even more recently, I was telling people, cause I had the signature class, top signature class, and I'm like all over the product, I guess. And all of my autos are redemptions. And I'm like, yeah, guys, I apologize. I've had those on my table for the past like two months. So I should have sent those back in. So there it is. If you wonder, and that's a good insight actually for, and I knew this fact, but like, if you get a redemption, it's because, you know, these superstars that are busy, you know, they got a life to live. Yeah, they get a little delay in signing. You could easily have been signing them while watching the game or doing stuff, watching film. But you're just like sitting there like, I'll get to those eventually. Not realizing that now all of your cards are redemptions because people have been waiting. And like, I remember there was a funny, Josh Allen had a similar story where he, a person brought in the redemption to the practice. So that was practice. And he signs a redemption saying, I'm sorry, man. I'll try and get those in here soon. Yeah. That is awesome. But it's, that is a crucial insight is usually, it's not because it's usually a delay. The player's got it, or it could be on the manufacturer. No, it's usually, it's usually our fault. I'll give you full, full transparency. Yeah. Like manufacturer, like the only time it's a manufacturer issue is if like they haven't been able to locate the player's new address and like haven't had a chance to get the cards to them. Normally, it's like the players get it to their whatever they play, like they deliver them to our arena sometimes. And your, you know, player manager or whoever it is that are for the team hands you their card and say, hey, get these signed, you know, having sure you have a witness, blah, blah, blah, blah. And then players are just like, yeah, I'll get them eventually. And then four months to go by, you'll realize, you know, that product came out two months ago. Maybe I should sign these. There it is. Breaking news. The truth comes out of why the redemptions happen. But it brings me a good question. All right. I got I got to follow up on that. So you now know collecting how important condition is. Yeah. Do those corners get dinged sometimes by the player? All the time. Okay. All right. There it is. Some players don't understand the value of the cards. Yeah, they don't know. They might be like, I have these Uno cards in front of me. So they might be like, all right, cool. Tapping them on the table, making sure they're stacked like this so that way they get a good sign. So it's just like, yeah. So sometimes it's not in the manufacturer. Sometimes it is. So sometimes when there's a consistent issue across a bunch of cards, like I know in like... like the series one with all K all Kings and they had those little peel ups on the back of the car. Yeah, that's probably manufacturer. But like the occasional where it's like, why is this corner dinged? If it wasn't like the breaker or the part of the packager or the person that did it or you got it straight out of a pack. Why does it look like this? Yeah. It sometimes can be the player that like accidentally did something with them or dropped them or was like looking at the cars, touching the corners like this and just kind of going after it. They try not to put those cards, I feel like, in the packs is what I assume because you'd sign so many of them. Like outside of the 99, whatever it is, they probably have six extra cards that you have to sign, like six to ten extra cards. So if like one messes up, you can always reprint it and stuff like that. But yeah, I don't know. Limited edition ones. Yeah. A little tougher. Yeah. Limited. The one of ones. Let's just say it's more difficult. Talking with Grant Williams, he is the forward of the Charlotte Hornets and professional ripper like yours truly. Grant, to that end, on-card stickers, you know, autos suck. It's like, you know, you've signed them, you know, and it's like you see them now in collecting. You don't want that sticker. Right. Like it's difficult because you hope to, you know, not have sticker autos. And you always wonder why, you know, like, why is there a sticker on this? And certain products, like they may not ship to the player. So that's what the stickers are for. And I think I've signed more stickers than I have actual cards, in my opinion. Like they have you sign so many because I don't think that sometimes they decide whether or not a player is going to be in a product. So like if they do decide this player is in this product, we don't want to always deal with redemptions with certain people. Like because some people might not sign consistently or some people like might be harder to track down. So like it's easier just to sticker it rather than to like have them sign 10,000 stickers. And then, you know, rather than send these 100 cards in the moment, they hope they come back in time. So I think that's part of the reason. But like for even for me, like I'd love a good on card auto. It makes it so like a card that much cleaner. And it just shows the players kind of had it in their hands. That's another thing that makes you feel kind of cool where it's like, hey, like I know Messi touched this card because it's something that's on card. Like he had to had to be there to be there to put this on. It's not like we're the ones, you know, signing stickers and they were peeling it off and going, you know, it's just a little bit different. I agree. I pulled – the boys and I opened Hobby 2025 signature Hobby Boxes this past weekend. Got a Magic Johnson on card. There we go. Yeah. Who was the other guy that I keep forgetting his name? And James Harden. And I know James Harden. Yeah, James Harden. Those two aren't the most common on-cards you get. I'll tell you that. It was pretty cool. I haven't seen, honestly, many James Carden on-card autos. Because it wasn't like he was this superstar prospect in the beginning. So even his rookie auto, I couldn't even tell you if he had. I haven't seen his rookie auto before. Yeah, it was cool. That was cool. And it was 10 out of 10. Sick. You know what's crazy? Like, the finest autos, I think, are so cool. So, like, Larry Bird signing and, like, those, like, legends that you, like, same product they had when they were playing, but, like, there's no autos of them. Like, I think that's such a cool way of, like, getting them back into it. Like, I have a Larry Bird top's finest auto to five at grading right now. And, like, for me, like, that's something that, like, Who knows what the value is worth of it, but like it's going to be a car that I had to my collection for the longest because Celtic, you know, old school design. It just seems so clean. Yeah, I'm a Celtics like closet, like Celtics fan. I don't I don't wear the gear around, but I've always pulled for him. I grew up watching Bird and McHale and the Chief, all the guys. old school. That was my, that's true old school. That's, that's fighting days. That's like back in the day when it was fun. Danny Ainge. Oh yeah. Yeah. Danny and those guys. Doc Rivers. I mean, you know, like days was playing old doc. Now the kids wouldn't even know doc was a, was a baller. Yeah, he was. I always think of his Hawks career and I'm always like, dang, Doc was nice. And then you look at you look at certain players like certain these former coaches like you'd be like, oh, they had a career like you don't play for the Spurs. You know, like certain people where it's like you just have you had no idea unless you were true, like ball knowledge, like ball. Steve Kerr. I mean, the Bulls won five, six titles. I don't know if he was there for all six years, but like four or five of them. Oh, no, but he won a lot because he went to the Spurs right after. He won those three with the Bulls, and he went to the Spurs and won immediately. And he's accomplished. Now he has all the coaching rings. He has more rings than most other than like Phil Jackson and Robert Horry. Yeah, Robert Horry. Dude, he's a dog in the playoffs. Underrated name right there. How many players collect? I mean, how prevalent is it? I think it's pretty prevalent now. A lot collect discreetly, I feel like, nowadays. Because, you know, not everybody wants to make content, wants to do these things where they show off kind of their collections. And some people just, like, are the ones who are the ones buying these cars on whatnot or buying these cars on eBay and Fanatics. And you have no idea, like, how did this car sell for this? And it's like, well, there's probably a player on the other side doing it. But, like, yeah. I have a lot of friends who are into it, but they just don't like the public knowledge of it. But then there's some that love it. I know, what's it called? From Laravia, from the Lakers. He loves collecting. Zach Levine's posted about how he's enjoyed collecting. There's a lot of guys who do, but then there's the ones who do it discreetly. Or even that just collect themselves. I know I talked to Seth Curry, and he just got into collecting sports. He doesn't collect at Disney with his daughter and people like that. But now he's into collecting his cards as well as his teammates and others. So he's been getting into that. So it's pretty cool. I got some cool Seth when he did V friends, some of those manga cards. He did. Did you just get any of the new V friends? Yes. Oh, yeah, it's coming. It's and I got I've signed up for a few other back deals. Gary's been on this show, been on a couple. My business show's the number one show in marketing on Apple, and he's been on it several times. So I'd call him a friendly acquaintance. I don't know that we're friends. I mean, I can serve a friend, but you know what I'm saying. But we know one another. And I love what he's done with that stuff. I think it's just getting started. I mean, it's a second round with Topps, and it's in high demand. I think this year's product's gonna be the one of the best to hold and also rip. Like I think it's just such a fun product. It's good as people are now learning about not only the characters, but like the stories behind them. Like I think it's just gonna continue to balloon. So like if you could find those 2023, like kind of 2024 kind of cases and stuff like that, like I'm a big fan of it. So like even right now, like I was like, I bought three cases and I was like, Do I rip all three? Do I rip one? So I'm like, rip one. See how it goes. That's what I'm saying. My plan is to rip one. I have it at the house. I have my house right now. So I'm rip one and now hold the other two. I have them in the vault because I can't keep anything in the house because if I do, it's going to be ripped. Oh, yeah. It helps that mine stay at the store. I take home what's like, yeah, okay, we can rip these. Right, right. You take them home because if you don't take them home, then you don't have to worry about it. But when they're at the house just hanging out, hanging around, you have to then be like, oh, it's upstairs. I feel like ripping something. I feel like taking a gamble. I might as well see if there's anything cool in this box. It is a fascinating thing. You know, our tagline at stores, you know, united in the chase. I mean, it is kind of that chase. And it's, I don't know. I mean, there's, there's all sides of it, but there's, I think it's a healthy thing on the collecting side as long as it's done responsibly. And it's, I'd rather, I don't know, you think about it, we got the pack bar. I mean, I'd rather people be bellied up to this pack bar than, you know, taking shots. Not that there's not a time and a place for everything, but it's a fascinating landscape because of just how popular it all is right now. Oh, no, it's going to keep ballooning, I feel like, because even in markets, you have Asia that's really popular. It's becoming popular. I don't think Europe's really taking it a full charge yet. And when that happens, I feel like it'll keep going. Because those European players on the sports side and soccer market, I'm surprised still by the soccer market right now because of how inexpensive cards are. And some of these best players, of course, Messi sells crazily. Of course, Ronaldo and these names. But like even like the Amals and the Hollands and like people who are currently playing that are like wicked, like more the old names where you have Ronaldo from old. You have, you know, Pele, you have all these names and soccer is probably the most global sport. So seeing that market and how it is honestly amazes me. And I think that it's just something that will continue to grow. The sports card market has ballooned in the past two years. It's unlike 2020. When 2020, I feel like there was just high sales. And it wasn't like people were like truly involved in the collecting. They weren't like bought in like collectors and like, I love this card. You know, it's now I feel like people are starting to get attached to products, get attached to players. Like my favorite player is this guy because I met him. So like, you know what? Rather than getting just a signed jersey, I'm going to get two of his rookie cards. You know, it's really cool. Yeah, man. And it just, again, with my boys, it was just fun to do something to do as a family and, you know, brought us together to hang out for a couple hours during that. You know, that was it was I would have spent whatever, you know, for those moments. Yeah, for those times. And like, especially like that's how I feel like I'll be with my like future kids where it's like, yeah. Even if it's just like night in sports and it's like, hey, you want to collect Disney? You want to collect these like certain characters you like to watch, like V friends who are reading the comic, like things like, hey, let's just spend some time at the kitchen table and just rip. And then next, you know, your excitement and joy is the same thing that I'll have. And it gives you those same like you look back to like, I remember that day when me and my dad were sitting in, you know. this card shop and we hit this crazy, even if it's not a valuable card, but it's the card I've had the rest of my life. Exactly. Brings a lot of moments. What, um, what's your favorite card and, and you know, like something you're chasing? Yeah, I feel like my favorite card in my collection right now is the gold star Charizard that I ripped. It's a TCG. Um, cause it's so, it was so rare to do and actually rip it and grade it. Like for me, that was like one of my favorite I have a Lionel Messi Dynasty Patch Auto that I freaking love that is so sick of this year. And something that's in my collection, that's more PC as well, asset card, kind of something that I can pass it down to my child in the future. And then I would say the other most important sports card that, you know, I'm a huge fan of. Like I have a bunch of like my own rookies, but more so the Mo Salah, like I'm a big Mo Salah fan. So his first autos in Dynasty this year. So I made sure to pick up an out of five patch auto. And of course I won as one of one, but I don't want to spend that level of money for it. But that for me is so cool. Those are two soccer cards. I collect baseball more for prospecting, just for the joy of it. I like to keep up with prospects. And then for football and basketball, teammates. So those are probably my personal collection journey and also my favorite cards. And then who I'm chasing right now, It depends. Like honestly, it depends on the product. Like if it's in a day, like. You name a case hit and I'm going after it. Yeah, like you name a product and I'm like, I'm all in on it. It's like Bowman baseball, I've been ripping a ton of them. And it's like, I've written more recently. And then on top of that, like I ripped some Topps Chrome Sapphire football and I hit an Aston Gennady Auto DeFi. And I'm like, is that like, for me, is it huge of a card for like my collecting journey? Probably not. But like, who was I looking for? Like, of course I'm like looking for friends that I know. So like. or people that like, I'm an Eagles fan, so I will try my best to find some Eagles players like, and rip those, like add those to my PC. So I haven't really, I haven't, honestly, I don't think I've sold an Eagles player. So it's pretty cool. Got those Hertz rookies hanging out. Yeah, no rookies, because those before, like 2020 was right when I started playing Pokemon, not sports. So that's where I don't have any Hertz rookies, but I have some Hertz cards that are really huge. Like really huge to me at least. Yeah, man. Is it a business at all for you, or is it all just collecting? For me, it's still kind of passion, hobby, collecting. Yeah. I've never really tried to make it a business, because then you have to worry about profits, and you know the other thing. And that's the fun. You're doing it as a true margin game, versus right now, I kind of do it as, you rip what you're comfortable ripping, where financially it makes sense. And then you try your best to collect the names. Of course you have cars that you want to hold for a lifetime that you pass down. I kind of have it in three folds. I have my assets like kind of cars, whereas my gold case, I have everything that, you know, could potentially be the 300,000, 200,000, 50,000 in the future. Like I ripped the gold downtown Wimby out of optic. And I graded it, got a nine. More recently, that card sold for, I think, close to 100 grand. Yeah. And I was like, you know, like, that's the card that you just keep in the collection. And, you know, you have it. And unless someone makes you an absolutely ridiculous offer for it, you know, you keep it for the next 10, 15, 20 years and then pass that down to your kids if you can. And then similar thing, like my Messi's in that case, a couple like major, like my basketball, like my LeBron James choice chalk toss. Cooper Flag, Catfish Jack All-Star, Auto, like similar products where it's like stuff that you just won't be able to find, goes to that case. And then you have my like personal collection, which is more like Eagles, like I said, the Liverpool like teammates, like my own cards where I have like a case for that. And then I have my last case where it's like, okay, this is the stuff that'll actually move and turn, Liquid Cards, Anthony Edward, like stuff like that where it's no true attachment or it's just products that I ripped and you know, you don't really see yourself keeping for the rest of your life. Hey man, the smart collecting though. Exactly. That's I like those three cases. Hey, taking notes, if you're listening, you know, that's a good, uh, it's a good order. It doesn't matter what the values are. They all could fall into those classifications. Yeah. It doesn't matter values. They each fall in their own category and how you see them. Like whether you, if you see it as your PC, then put it in your PC case and don't touch it because it's tough when you dip into your PC case and now you're like, no, dang, like I sold that card and like, I wish I had that for the rest of my life, you know? So for me, it's like, all right, cool. So PC case knows that when that case is open and shut, it's open and shut. There is no open and back up and, you know, shuffle through and move. And then the other two cases are more like, all right, just quit transaction. The other one is gold and asset. That's really the two, three main things that I would say are at all add up. Grant, I'll get you out of here. About a real quick rapid fire, just a few questions related to the hobby. Yes, let's do it. Most underrated player to collect. Ooh. In what sport? That's really a question. Yeah, I know. Exactly. Let's say basketball. Let's say basketball. So it's your player. If you had told me this two years ago, I would have said Tyrese Maxey at the time. Yeah. Nowadays, that's what makes it tough. Because the hard part about the hobby is some people don't get the respect they deserve. So I like, of course, I like a guy like Garrett Queen right now. He's a really talented rookie. He can really pass the ball. Then there's the guys that take off, like Jalen Johnson. I would have told you that last year because I thought he was talented and good. And I saw the Hawks, how they were progressing them. how they're pushing them. I like my TASP of Zulus from Chicago. It's just tough because they might not win, you know? So like there's a couple of players that like you hope will continue to be great. And probably the most like their markets aren't great, but it really just depends on what their team's success does. So those are my three probably right now that I like, just because I think that, They're under the radar and they'll jump, I think, as season comes in and comes around. Of course, you know, there's superstars that are great, but I try my best to stay away from those unless they are somebody I think can be like LeBron. One teammate whose cards you would buy now. Oh, yeah. So the cons dip market is dipped. So that's a great market to get into, of course, because, you know, of course, you might not have the rookie of the year, but buzz or success. But as the Hornets continue to get better, whether it's Con, LaMelo or Brandon, I think all three I would buy into just because as team continues to get better and as a. as we all continue to improve and perform, you know, he's a real deal. Yeah. They'll all join. Like I think those three just will all, he wasn't a flash in the pan. You think he's got the, no, he's top. Yeah. He's got some goods. He's got the goods. And those three really all have the goods. So I would say those three on our team. One player you wish you'd collected earlier. Wimby, even more. I collected him to a decent amount. We knew about it. We all knew he was coming in. Everybody knew he was good. Everybody knew he was good, but the question was, how good could he be? Of course, I had some major cards of him. I had, like I said, gold downtown and some rookie autos and things of that interest basis. But I didn't get any Panini silvers or Panini color. I would have loved to have a gold shimmer Wimby rookie right now. And back then you could have bought it probably for like 10K or 15K. Now you're not touching it for less than 100 or 200. So, and if not a million on certain cards. So it's, it's, it's ridiculous. One card you'd never sell. Like my Mewtwo Shadowless, my Gold Star Zard, as well as really any of the cards on my PC case, like Eagles, Liverpool and Grant Williams cards, probably those two. Grant Williams, we got to do it. Hey, it's been fun, man. Promise me we'll get together at some point. Let's do it. I promise. And listen, it's easy. We're only about what? Two hours away from one. I think we're less than that. I'm driving. I'll get you in the Audi. It'll be fast. Yeah. I'll follow your lead then. Because let's just say, let's just say I'm staying away from, from, from the speed and tickets in that route. If I can. Cool, bro. I really appreciate it. Give me a, give the audience, they know who you are, but any deets on, you know, we're going to follow you and all that stuff. Of course. Yeah. My name is Grant Williams, player for the Charlotte Hornets forward. I have a Instagram grant will to collects. That's my collecting page. Grant will to is just my personal page. So if you guys want to see a little mix of both, you can follow either one YouTube channel as well. Grant will to grant to will. And last but not least, I just, you know, if you guys see me in the community, come say hello, because I'm always willing to make a deal, trade, buy, sell, and also just to have some chats, you know, talk about basketball, talk about any sports you want to talk about, as well as talk about TCG if you know a little bit about it. I got you. Appreciate it, man. It's been a lot of fun. Let's do it again soon. Let's do it again soon, and we'll do it in person next time. For sure. Hey, guys, you know where to find us, thecollectornation.com. We appreciate you bringing us up to number three in sports. We beat out those Kelsey brothers this week. Y'all don't even know what's going on. Hey, you know what, finally, I'm at Ryan Alford on Instagram. We appreciate you. We appreciate Grant. Dude, I'm buying now. I got Grant Williams. This guy is a gym on the court, off the court. We appreciate him. See you next time on Collector Nation. Thanks for tuning in to the show. Be sure to follow us on your go-to podcast platform and catch the full video episode over on YouTube. Visit us at collectornation.com and follow Ryan on Instagram at Ryan Alford. Now get out there and collect yours.